Topic: Help on how to build a budget meal home theater

[denber]

Good day mga gurus,
This will be my 1st post and I'm not sure if I posted this on the right section. I spent some time reading other threads dito sa PinoyDVD. I've learned a lot lalo na sa home theater. Akala ko dati ang home audio is basta ka lang maka bili ng HTIB sa appliance center yun na yun. Boy, I was wrong big time!!! I'm on a tight budget kaya I would be going for the 2nd hand items.
My questions po is, how much ba yung budget for a decent 2nd hand source (audio/video), speakers (5.1 or if any suggestions). Ive read in some thread also na pwede din pa isa-isa muna yung pag bili until maka buo ako ng home theater ko.
Baka kasi yung price ng HTIB na bibilhin ko eh pwede na ako maka bili ng 2nd hand na speakers and source nun.
Hope you could help me. thanks

[audiojunkie]

Good day mga gurus,
This will be my 1st post and I'm not sure if I posted this on the right section. I spent some time reading other threads dito sa PinoyDVD. I've learned a lot lalo na sa home theater. Akala ko dati ang home audio is basta ka lang maka bili ng HTIB sa appliance center yun na yun. Boy, I was wrong big time!!! I'm on a tight budget kaya I would be going for the 2nd hand items.
My questions po is, how much ba yung budget for a decent 2nd hand source (audio/video), speakers (5.1 or if any suggestions). Ive read in some thread also na pwede din pa isa-isa muna yung pag bili until maka buo ako ng home theater ko.
Baka kasi yung price ng HTIB na bibilhin ko eh pwede na ako maka bili ng 2nd hand na speakers and source nun.
Hope you could help me. thanks

Una po... Welcome to pdvd... You are in the right place for SARS... marami nga dapat e consider in setting up HT. Una check nyo ang used & new gears esp. HT receiver against features that you might need in the future. Syempre medyo pricy ang new but it's upgrade proof for sometime. Other gears don't change fast in audio & video format. Speakers you can have both used or new as long you have matching pairs or specs.

[denber]

Una po... Welcome to pdvd... You are in the right place for SARS... marami nga dapat e consider in setting up HT. Una check nyo ang used & new gears esp. HT receiver against features that you might need in the future. Syempre medyo pricy ang new but it's upgrade proof for sometime. Other gears don't change fast in audio & video format. Speakers you can have both used or new as long you have matching pairs or specs.

thanks po, I've been checking the market section for source/receiver but I still have no clue what price should I look for a decent pre-owned set-up. Unlike car audio na madali lang makita ang distinction between entry level gear from a mid-level or high end gears. But in home audio medyo tagilid ako. could you point me in the right direction?
I just want to have a good sound system that I could use both for movies and music most of the time. I have around 290sqr-ft(27.5sqr-mtr) of living room. I dont see my self upgrading my sound system anytime soon dahil as long as it plays good music, have USB, RCA's and HDMI I think I'll be good na.
No wonder why some prefer to buy HTIB's than building their own system its a bit complicated Well unless you have deep pockets then you wont be having my dilemma right now. hehehe.

[audiojunkie]

thanks po, I've been checking the market section for source/receiver but I still have no clue what price should I look for a decent pre-owned set-up. Unlike car audio na madali lang makita ang distinction between entry level gear from a mid-level or high end gears. But in home audio medyo tagilid ako. could you point me in the right direction?
I just want to have a good sound system that I could use both for movies and music most of the time. I have around 290sqr-ft(27.5sqr-mtr) of living room. I dont see my self upgrading my sound system anytime soon dahil as long as it plays good music, have USB, RCA's and HDMI I think I'll be good na.
No wonder why some prefer to buy HTIB's than building their own system its a bit complicated Well unless you have deep pockets then you wont be having my dilemma right now. hehehe.

There's nothing wrong in HTIB either you're pro or beginner. It has other advantages than separate receiver. It's more on convenience and simplicity. Less wire clutter space requirement. Unlike the stand alone receiver all gears are connected by dedicated wires or cable. As you already mentioned in your post the basic requirements your looking for a receiver. Next the power requirement that depends on what speaker you plan to pair with it. Don't forget to GQ sub makes a big difference in movies either you're using BS or FS speakers. For prices, I'm not very familiar and depends on model, features, wattage and condition of the unit. As everyone's suggestion to audition at store to have comparisons of every brand or model.

[denber]

There's nothing wrong in HTIB either you're pro or beginner. It has other advantages than separate receiver. It's more on convenience and simplicity. Less wire clutter space requirement. Unlike the stand alone receiver all gears are connected by dedicated wires or cable. As you already mentioned in your post the basic requirements your looking for a receiver. Next the power requirement that depends on what speaker you plan to pair with it. Don't forget to GQ sub makes a big difference in movies either you're using BS or FS speakers. For prices, I'm not very familiar and depends on model, features, wattage and condition of the unit. As everyone's suggestion to audition at store to have comparisons of every brand or model.

Pardon my ignorance po. Ano po yung GQ Sub, BS and FS speakers?

[zram18]

BS-bookshelf speakers
FS-floorstanding speakers

for me, wag ka muna mag 5.1 set, 2.1 muna to build a "budget meal" home theater setup (naks, parang jolllibee mc do eto ha, hehe).

kidding aside, start with a good second hand laptop first. build up your digital sources: your favorite collection of  music or movies or concert you like.

then next step, this will be your budget:(estimates only)
   second hand AVR-10k (entry level pioneer,yamaha,onkyo etc) sa pier, 5k lang mga mura pero risky
                                  and not advisable pag di ka marunong mag ayos ng receiver
   second hand BS-5k (wharfedale,polk,monitor audio,anthony audio,etc)
   speaker stands-ipatong mo muna sa upuan/mesa na di ginagamit para tipid
   ok na to pero bitin yan, hence, you need to add this:

   second hand subwoofer-5k (us audio,daichi,etc)
   wires pa pala: raon wires only/second hand wires
   total expense: estimate 20k

this set will be your 2.1 system. you can live with this setup na kc may nice sound setup/home theater ka na.

then later on as time goes by, pag my budget ulit, upgrade to 5.1 by adding the ff:
   second hand center-4k
   second hand surround-4k
   wires: raon wires only
   total cost: 8k

wag ka na mag DVD/blu ray kung budget set up lang. kasi, plaka pa lang ng blu ray 1,500/movie na.
but if you want, add this:
   DVD player/blu ray player
   selected DVDs/blu ray discs

maganda rin yung paganda ng paganda ang home theater mo at maapreciate mo yung improvements. pero beware na pag bumili ka ng second hand, walang warranty yun, hence there is still the risk na masira din agad yung gears na binili mo unlike brand new na merong warranty.

hope my opinion for your budget meal setup helped you.

[audiojunkie]

Pardon my ignorance po. Ano po yung GQ Sub, BS and FS speakers?

GQ = Good Quality

Already mentioned by zram18
BS
FS

[dodie]

sir you have a 27sqm living room. malaki sya para sa bookshelf! decent bugdet, i think it will be around 70-100k, medyo iwas upgrade na ito. buy the best speaker that will fit your budget, sya yung buhay ng system. wag kang magpapamenos sa speakers. pag ma music ka, im inclined to suggest na marantz receiver audition mo. much better than onkyo sa music.

btw, pag nag audition ka sir ang una mong pakinggan yung mga magaganda na speaker. wala namang bayad mag audition. tapos sya yung gawin mong reference sa pagpili ng gusto mo. kse kung yung HTIB ang benchmark mo, malamang lahat ng maudition nyong  speAkers maganda sa pandinig mo.

[audiojunkie]

Di pa nga naka first base .. . Na kulam na agad bossing ...       

[denber]

BS-bookshelf speakers
FS-floorstanding speakers

for me, wag ka muna mag 5.1 set, 2.1 muna to build a "budget meal" home theater setup (naks, parang jolllibee mc do eto ha, hehe).

kidding aside, start with a good second hand laptop first. build up your digital sources: your favorite collection of  music or movies or concert you like.

then next step, this will be your budget:(estimates only)
   second hand AVR-10k (entry level pioneer,yamaha,onkyo etc) sa pier, 5k lang mga mura pero risky
                                  and not advisable pag di ka marunong mag ayos ng receiver
   second hand BS-5k (wharfedale,polk,monitor audio,anthony audio,etc)
   speaker stands-ipatong mo muna sa upuan/mesa na di ginagamit para tipid
   ok na to pero bitin yan, hence, you need to add this:

   second hand subwoofer-5k (us audio,daichi,etc)
   wires pa pala: raon wires only/second hand wires
   total expense: estimate 20k

this set will be your 2.1 system. you can live with this setup na kc may nice sound setup/home theater ka na.

then later on as time goes by, pag my budget ulit, upgrade to 5.1 by adding the ff:
   second hand center-4k
   second hand surround-4k
   wires: raon wires only
   total cost: 8k

wag ka na mag DVD/blu ray kung budget set up lang. kasi, plaka pa lang ng blu ray 1,500/movie na.
but if you want, add this:
   DVD player/blu ray player
   selected DVDs/blu ray discs

maganda rin yung paganda ng paganda ang home theater mo at maapreciate mo yung improvements. pero beware na pag bumili ka ng second hand, walang warranty yun, hence there is still the risk na masira din agad yung gears na binili mo unlike brand new na merong warranty.

hope my opinion for your budget meal setup helped you.

thanks for that detailed response sir I'll be keeping that in mind. 20k for wires? I might be better off with a set of brandnew gears nga. We'll see where I go from here. Just like in my car, nung nag start ako mag tanong-tanong ok na sa akin yung mga targa brands but then I ended up with polk speakers and rockford fosgate amps

sir you have a 27sqm living room. malaki sya para sa bookshelf! decent bugdet, i think it will be around 70-100k, medyo iwas upgrade na ito. buy the best speaker that will fit your budget, sya yung buhay ng system. wag kang magpapamenos sa speakers. pag ma music ka, im inclined to suggest na marantz receiver audition mo. much better than onkyo sa music.
btw, pag nag audition ka sir ang una mong pakinggan yung mga magaganda na speaker. wala namang bayad mag audition. tapos sya yung gawin mong reference sa pagpili ng gusto mo. kse kung yung HTIB ang benchmark mo, malamang lahat ng maudition nyong  speAkers maganda sa pandinig mo.

Medyo malaki-laki nga po yung living room ko. Pupose ko talaga to widen the living room kasi nung nag rerent pa lang kami ng apartment medyo cramped parati yung living room space. kaya when I got my own house I decide to make it bigger na hindi cramped lahat ng mga gamit sa isang sulok. I really want to experience some auditioning on my prospectec gears but the thing is I'm from a small town in mindanao. I might find some time pag nasa manila ako to go to some audio stores for audi.
I'm an OFW working on a ship. Some of our ports in europe sell some audios gears also. I saw a set of Harman Kardon AVR170 and Harman Kardon HKTS16 5.1 speakers. Mga 44k kung sa peso ang price.
Ok po ba yung price nun compare sa pinas? baka mga 15-20kg siguro ang weight nun. Or mas ok na sa pinas na ako bumili since kahit dito sa pinoyDVD yung ibang audio shop accepts deffered paymenst sa card.

Di pa nga naka first base .. . Na kulam na agad bossing ...       

Matagal na ata ako nakulam sir. Di lang ako maka galaw dahil sa budget constraints. I'm pampering my wife ngayon so that she'll give me support on my plans sa home audio

[Oldboyracer]

Welcome to PDVD denber, as audiojunkie has already stated it would be advisable to audition various gears so you will have an idea of what sounds good to your ears (that's what matters, your ears not other peoples). You will also get an idea of costs & can arrange your budget to suit.
I would suggest you buy locally as there could be warranty issues with gears purchased abroad. I speak from experience having bought all my gears in the UK before relocating to Cebu. I now have a couple of problems which are proving difficult to resolve & may require replacing the gears - ouch.

[audiojunkie]

Yup, I agree with OBR. I suggest to look for good quality wires/cables which may be too expensive at our local market. even used are still fine these don't have much warranty issues. small pieces of gears are also okay as long as they don't take much of your luggage back home.

[denber]

Thanks sir Oldboyracer and audiojunkie. Will definitely take heed both of your advices.

[dodie]

Medyo malaki-laki nga po yung living room ko. Pupose ko talaga to widen the living room kasi nung nag rerent pa lang kami ng apartment medyo cramped parati yung living room space. kaya when I got my own house I decide to make it bigger na hindi cramped lahat ng mga gamit sa isang sulok. I really want to experience some auditioning on my prospectec gears but the thing is I'm from a small town in mindanao. I might find some time pag nasa manila ako to go to some audio stores for audi.
I'm an OFW working on a ship. Some of our ports in europe sell some audios gears also. I saw a set of Harman Kardon AVR170 and Harman Kardon HKTS16 5.1 speakers. Mga 44k kung sa peso ang price.
Ok po ba yung price nun compare sa pinas? baka mga 15-20kg siguro ang weight nun. Or mas ok na sa pinas na ako bumili since kahit dito sa pinoyDVD yung ibang audio shop accepts deffered paymenst sa card.

you are better off with newer models sir. old model na kse yung hk170. and the hkts16,its like an HTIB na walang receiver.  since para syang sattelite speaker, bass shy yan, kaya sinamahan nila ng sub. dito ka na lang kuha po sa aten. kung hindi ka po maselan there are lot of exellent speaker at decent prices. pangalawa since it will be in the living room, dapat hindi sya masyadong masculine (so big and boxy is a no no) and it should compliment the living room fixtures para ok kay misis. sa lahat ng problema sir ang etong problema ng HT setup ang pinakamasarap! kung gusto mong dagdagan ng pure audio, mas dadami ang problema mo, pero mas liligaya ka naman!

 hapiness is a choice, so choose your gears wisely. dont cut corners and avoid underspending cause in the the long run youll overspend!

[Nelson de Leon]

And since familiar ka na sa Polk Audio, Madami din magagandang Polk Audio na speakers.

[sovrain]

Natatawa ako minsan sa bilas ko na seaman din, kung ano ano ang naiuuwing audio gears, minsan, sa raon bumibili. Pero, ikaw brader, ika nga, marunong ang nagtatanong. You're on the right community, community ng mga mangkukulam, pero mga matulungin at mababait, at hindi ka ililigaw. Ako, suggestion ko, multi channel ka na agad, may movie ka na, may music ka pa. Saka mo na isipin yang dedicated na audio gears. Kapag nasa mga audio/video shop ka jan sa europe, ilista mo ang mga napupusuan mo na kanilang mga paninda, tapos, ipost mo dito para mapayuhan ka ng mga masters kung alin ang dapat mong iuwi....

[Nelson de Leon]

Natatawa ako minsan sa bilas ko na seaman din, kung ano ano ang naiuuwing audio gears, minsan, sa raon bumibili. Pero, ikaw brader, ika nga, marunong ang nagtatanong. You're on the right community, community ng mga mangkukulam, pero mga matulungin at mababait, at hindi ka ililigaw. Ako, suggestion ko, multi channel ka na agad, may movie ka na, may music ka pa. Saka mo na isipin yang dedicated na audio gears. Kapag nasa mga audio/video shop ka jan sa europe, ilista mo ang mga napupusuan mo na kanilang mga paninda, tapos, ipost mo dito para mapayuhan ka ng mga masters kung alin ang dapat mong iuwi....

I have to agree with you. Yun dedicated 2 channel, maganda overseas na baka maka-tyempo ng mga exotic and magagandang brands na mura. At least 2.1 system din ang suggestion ko. Then he can dedicate the front BS for surrounds if he would opt for FS sa future for fronts. Hindi biro ang 27 sq m. na area. For reference level SPL, baka kailangan mo na ng powered pro-audio speakers diyan lalo pa kung open ang mga paligid. Pero kung descent levels lang, you're good with BS as long as you cut it at 80hz para mataas mo ang SPL when needed.

Re bilas, ganyan din ang bro-in-law ko. Gusto ng multi-channel, sabi ko mag-entry level pre-owned receiver na lang. But this one is opposite, ako pa ang pinagtawanan. Bakit daw siya bibili ng 75w samantalang 500w daw ang mga amp sa raon. Basta daw 5 hanggang 9 ang speakers with sub, 9.1 na daw lalabas ang tunog. Di na daw kailangan ng decoding from DTS and DD. Though before nila buuin ang system nila, na-audition naman ang luma kong system. Ganun din daw yun with any 9 speakers and sub.

[zram18]

malaki nga ang room mo sir, that s SO BIG, parang mini auditorium na ang 27 sq. meters area. hindi yan ang ideal size ng room/bedroom setup. baka puwede mo cya hatiin by placing a divider/cabinet furniture para mas manageable ang sound acoustics. pag masyado malaki kc, para ka ng nasa outdoor at you need a more powerful amp and speakers to cover the entire area.

seaman ka pala,so take advantage of your opportunity as seaman since nakakapunta ka pala sa iba ibang bansa. baka di u alam na marami ang murang audio gears abroad na pagdating d2 pilipinas ay overpriced na due to transportation costs,customs duties,wharfage dues at sandamakmak na taxes sa Bureau of Customs.

example ko na lang po ay yung sikat na brand ng subwoofer d2 sa pdvd. ang price abroad ay US499 lang. pero ang seller d2 sa pinas ay 29k ang price. kung imultiply mo ang US500 X 42.00 =  so P 21,000 lang pag binili abroad. di ba overprice ng 8k pesos pag d2 mo sa pinas binili?

in other words, mas makakamura ka on the spot kung bibili ka sa abroad ng brand new gears every time na uuwi ka d2 pinas, tutal pwede mo naman bitbitin yun sa airport. being a personal item, wala na pakialam ang Bureau of Customs sa nabili mo at di ka na sisingilin ng kung anoanong taxes.

and another one, you need to increase your budget, maybe one month of your salary as a seaman pwede na,maganda na yun tutal mga 5-10 years or more mo naman gagamitin yun at satisfied and happy ka pa in the long run with a sense of accomplishment sa mga naipundar mo.

[Nelson de Leon]

example ko na lang po ay yung sikat na brand ng subwoofer d2 sa pdvd. ang price abroad ay US499 lang. pero ang seller d2 sa pinas ay 29k ang price. kung imultiply mo ang US500 X 42.00 =  so P 21,000 lang pag binili abroad. di ba overprice ng 8k pesos pag d2 mo sa pinas binili?

I agree with you na there are times na makakamura ka when you buy abroad. Though parang masakit naman ata sir pakinggan yun word na "overprice", hehe! May mga taxes na binabayaran ang mga distros natin dito, plus yun requirement na starting and minimum stock, cost of money ets ng mga distributors dito sa Pinas. Plus warranty costs ng mga distro dito.

[ricky]

I would suggest for you to get the best 3.1 speaker you can afford. Start from there, speakers for me is the anchor for any good system. Electronics gets updated every now and then due to technology so if you think about it , it would not stay with you that long.

Listen around, and if you can ask some of the members here if you can listen to their system so much the better.

I agree with you na there are times na makakamura ka when you buy abroad. Though parang masakit naman ata sir pakinggan yun word na "overprice", hehe! May mga taxes na binabayaran ang mga distros natin dito, plus yun requirement na starting and minimum stock, cost of money ets ng mga distributors dito sa Pinas. Plus warranty costs ng mga distro dito.

Yup i agree wrong term yung "overpriced"

Its really cheaper to buy sa abroad pero paano shipping, taxes, risk of damage and most importantly yung warranty support.

Sa akin masasabi ko lang na overpriced ang item pag compared sa abroad eh more than 50% yung difference in price even after adding all the incidentals.

Yung sikat na subwoofer bargain na dito sa atin ying 8t lang ang difference, good marketing strategy. Shipping pa lang ng sub pwede na pumalo ng 3t 30-45days arrival, and more than 8t kung 1 week arrival.

Imho yung mga electronics like receivers and sources ang pwedeng sugalan abroadkasi talagang ang layo ng price difference. Yung nga lang 110v at walang warranty at most esp peace of mind.

[audiojunkie]

Lahat na suggestions magaganda at pwede pero meron pros & cons, gaya ng mura nga pero sa shipping naman madadale + tax kun ma check sa customs. Speakers pwede rin basta yung hi end na wala dyan sa atin kun mabili mo ng mura isugal mo na ang shipping. Subwoofer naman marami sa atin na magaganda w/ warranty at di hussle sa byahe. As suggested, HT setup para 2 in 1 ika (HT/Audio), gaya ng nasabi nyo sa Europe ang byahe at marami magaganda audio gears dyan very rare sa atin. Gaya stereo preamp, DAC (digital to analog converter), phono preamp, CD players at TT, ilan lang yan for dedicated audio gears. Baka mabili nyo ng mura dahil local buyer ka at kun di nyo kailangan ngayon, baka bukas makalawa kaiangan nyo at kun idle lang talaga marami dito ang magkaka gusto dyan. You can charge for handling para bawi rin pagod nyo. Another advantage, power voltage same sa atin, no need of step down transformer. Wag ka lang bibili ng BD player at ibang zone sa Europe at mahirap makakuha ng BD film sa atin.

[sovrain]

Hindi naman kalakihan yang 27 sq.m.,  that is 5m x 5.4m lang, mine is 5x5.5 katabi pa ang dining at same size, = 55sq.m....so no worries siguro na mabitin ka sa sound anuman ang ilagay mo jan...

[sovrain]

Re: bilas: ganito yung binili nya, @1000$, tapos bumili na sa raon ng 2 BS and karaoke amp. Ang sa kanya, basta malakas na, maganda, ginawang sub na lang yung bose ....

http://www.bose.com/controller?url=/shop_online/speakers/portable_amplification_systems/l1_compact/index.jsp

point is, wag ilagay ang pibakamalaking parte ng budget sa iisang gear, at bumili ng mumurahin on other gears para lang makakumpleto. Sayang yung potentials ng bose ni bilas

[Timithekid]

Nakakatakot talaga magtanong dito, ang daming mangkukulam! LOL

But, none of the suggestions are wrong.  Depende lahat yan sa gusto mong diskarte sa pagbuo ng system at tunog na gusto MO (Emphasis on mo kasi ikaw ang makikinig, so dapat ikaw ang masaya, di yung opinion ng ibang tao).  Pero ang pinakamagandang suggestion ng lahat is to audition, audition, audition.  Hanggang mahanap mo yung tunog na di mo makalimutan ang binabalikbalikan sa iyong isip--parang chicks! hehe

Ako when I started, ang budget ko was 50K kasi ang presyo ng HTIB nung nagbubuo ako was about 27K na, so I thought, if I double the price, maybe I can get something way better.  Lo and behold I ended up with a pair of floorstanders and a receiver--langhiya, ang mahal pala ng magandang 5.1.  In short 2.0 lang, ni sub wala.  But the nice thing about not scrimping on what you buy, is that you won't need to upgrade the system itself, rather, you are building it from the ground up.  So from a simple 2.0, you can purchase a sub, 2.1 ka na, then later on kapag nakaipon ka na ulit, center naman, tapos kayod ka ulit, then get your rear speakers.  before you know it, you have a 5.1 system.  It may take you 2 years, heck maybe more, but by the time you are finished--you will want more! MWAHAHAHAH!...ay mali, I meant by the time you are finished, maganda na kaagad ang system mo, you wont need to sell speakers and receivers just to upgrade to something better.

The best feeling in building your home theater is not the end product itself (although that is nice too).  Its the journey in building what you want and how you worked for it to be complete that makes the darn thing satisfying.

Enjoy your build sir, and Welcome to PINOYDVD.

[meat_eater]

First before building a Budget home theater, define your MAX budget for everything.

For that size, I suggest a bookshelf speakers as fronts with a timbre matched center. With that room size, you could consider 5-6 inched drivers.

For rears, a slightly smaller, but timbre matched rears would do, like a 4-5 in woofer.

For an AVR, you could get a 5.1 AVR instead of a 7.1 to cut down on cost, but I suggest get one with room correction capabilities, preferably at least Audyssey multi eq XT.

Of course, since you will be using BS speakers, get the necessary stands - one that fits your listening height.

As for subwoofers, this is where it gets quite expensive, and you could save up for this in the future. For "budget" or "bang for buck", I could only recommend SVS subs, it may be a little pricier compared to models made by Polk, Klipsch, Wharfdale - But in my honest opinion, the price to performance ratio is not even close, and those SVS subs are really worth every centavo.

Lastly, the room acoustics. Once you've completed the system, you can start treating your room, but then again this is a different matter all together.

Cheap but good quality interconnects can be had, so no need to concern yourself with exotic ones - for the meantime 

Hope this helps and happy hunting!

[comet]

my take, maganda yung suggestion ni Bro Dodie, audition the high end then make them your reference. Room acoustics can make entry level items soundvery good and unfortunately would be taken into consideration when all equipments have been bought. Check for the best center and subwoofer(svs for me) that  you can get.

[sientobente]

You can start step by step. Go with front speakers first, bookshelf or floorstander and an AVR. Then next go for a sub, then center, last would be surrounds. I myself start with surrounds first than the center though.

[zram18]

sorry, my apologies to the word "overprice"-should have been priced higher.
items bought abroad are priced higher when sold here in the philippines, thats what i mean.

its an honest mistake on my part and no malicious intent to hurt by its other meaning.

[Tempter]

The most important part is to get na kung ano man ang gusto mo...

Ok lang mag-upgrade later, basta gamitin mo muna ang meron ka. At wag basa ng basa! hehe!!! Masisiraan ka ng ulo sa dami ng choices mo at kalaunan magiging isa ka sa mga taong walang katapusang upgrade.

[ricky]

sorry, my apologies to the word "overprice"-should have been priced higher.
items bought abroad are priced higher when sold here in the philippines, thats what i mean.

its an honest mistake on my part and no malicious intent to hurt by its other meaning.

We know. No problem sir.